THE NEW TRANSSEXUALS

Amanda Lepore

Diva

Photo: Fred H. Berger

George Petros: WE’RE TALKING TO AMANDA LEPORE. YOUR SONG “MY PUSSY” — THAT’S KIND OF AN ANTHEM. COULD YOU TELL US SOMETHING ABOUT THAT TUNE?

Amanda Lepore: Larry Tee wrote that and he wanted to do a song with me and he thought that everyone wanted to hear me talk about my pussy.

DID YOU HAVE AS MUCH FUN SINGING THAT AS YOU DID “COTTON CANDY”?

Amanda Lepore: Yeah. They’re both really a lot of fun. I think “Cotton Candy” has more lyrics. So, it’s definitely more challenging.

SO THIS IS DANCE MUSIC THAT YOU’RE DOING —

Amanda Lepore: Yeah, it’s like Pop and Dance.

WHAT WAS THE EARLIEST STUFF YOU REMEMBER LISTENING TO? WHEN YOU WERE A KID, WHAT DID YOU LIKE?

Amanda Lepore: I liked a lot of Rock & Roll-kinda stuff, I guess. Madonna I liked a lot — especially the early stuff.

WHEN YOU WERE A KID, YOU KNEW YOU WERE A GIRL. THAT’S A TIME WHEN MOST PEOPLE ARE GETTING THEIR FIRST KISS OR FIRST SOMETHING OR OTHER. YOU SEEM TO HAVE BEEN A BIT MORE ADVANCED THAN THE OTHER KIDS YOUR AGE —

Amanda Lepore: Yeah, in some ways. I guess I put all my focus to wanting to be a girl. I didn’t feel comfortable with my body. It was like a different sort of development.

AND YOUR FAMILY WAS NOT SUPPORTIVE, RIGHT?

Amanda Lepore: They didn’t really like it but I think they were used to me from over the years, and I was always really feminine, so it wasn’t really a shock to them.

I SEE.

Amanda Lepore: They were just used to me.

YOU MUST HAVE FELT MORE COMFORTABLE AND RELAXED IN THAT FEMININE ROLE, BUT IT MUST HAVE BEEN TOUGH AT SCHOOL.

Amanda Lepore: Yeah, I had a hard time at school. I didn’t really go. Whenever I could skip school, I would skip it — definitely. Finally, they gave me a tutor, the second year of high school. I was able to get a high school diploma and be at home.

THERE MUST HAVE BEEN A FEW KIDS THAT YOU WERE TIGHT WITH, WHO LIKED YOU FOR YOU. WAS THERE A CREW THAT YOU RAN WITH?

Amanda Lepore: No, I didn’t really run with a crew — but I had close friends in and out of my life. For sure. I spent a lot of time by myself, though.

THAT’S A MIXED BLESSING FOR A KID, ISN’T IT?

Amanda Lepore: Yeah, I think I would rather have been around a lot of people, you know, if I could change the past. It’s just the way things were.

WHERE DID YOU HANG OUT?

Amanda Lepore: I didn’t really hang out so much, you know? Occasionally I went to night clubs and things. I was more a loner. I spent a lot of time by myself.

WHEN YOU WERE FIFTEEN YOU GOT A RHINOPLASTY?

Amanda Lepore: Yes.

AND THAT WAS A GIFT FROM SOMEONE, RIGHT?

Amanda Lepore: Yeah.

WAS IT FROM YOUR BOYFRIEND?

Amanda Lepore: Yeah, it was a boyfriend at the time.

SURGERY CAN BE A VERY LIBERATING MEDIUM, I WOULD SUPPOSE.

Amanda Lepore: Yeah, definitely — if something is bothering you, it’s definitely important to dismiss it so that you can focus on other things.

SURGERY’S AN ART FORM, FROM THE SURGEON’S PERSPECTIVE —

Amanda Lepore: Yes.

IN YOUR QUEST TO PERFECT YOURSELF, IF I COULD CALL IT THAT, YOU SUBSEQUENTLY HAD OTHER SURGERIES. YOU GOT A BOOB JOB, RIGHT?

Amanda Lepore: Yeah — well, I actually had my sex changed before I had big boobs.

I SEE. GENITAL REASSIGNMENT — THAT STRIKES ME AS A MEDICAL MIRACLE.

Amanda Lepore: Yeah, it really is.

IT’S ALMOST LIKE A SCIENCE-FICTION THING. AND, YOU KNOW, THERE’S AN ELEMENT OF BRAVERY NECESSARY —

Amanda Lepore: A lot of people told me that, but I don’t think it’s really bravery. It’s more a necessity. I mean, it was for me.

SO, DOES A HORMONAL REGIMEN PRECEDE THIS SURGERY?

Amanda Lepore: Yes.

AND HOW LONG DOES THAT GO ON?

Amanda Lepore: You have to be on it at least two years before they will allow you to have the surgery and live as a girl.

HOW OLD WERE YOU WHEN YOU STARTED THE REGIMEN?

Amanda Lepore: I think like fifteen. Around the same time I had the nose done.

AND THE HORMONES OBVIOUSLY MADE YOU FEEL A LOT DIFFERENT, I WOULD BET. DID YOU FEEL MORE RELAXED AND MORE CHILL —

Amanda Lepore: Yeah, definitely. It makes you more content and relaxed.

AND IT ALSO CAUSES CHANGES TO THE BODY —

Amanda Lepore: Yeah, it was pretty dramatic with mine, I think. It was a gradual kind of thing — but I had boobs really quickly, within a month. Like, there would be breast pains, and if you took a shower the water would hurt — but I think it was because I was taking it while still in puberty. So, they worked really quickly.

IT’S PROBABLY GOOD YOU TOOK HORMONES EARLY ON AND HAD THEM COINCIDE WITH YOUR BODY’S DEVELOPMENT.

Amanda Lepore: Yeah, definitely. I think it’s just more of a natural sort of a thing, when you start really young. Because male hormones don’t start to set in — they told me that after you’re twenty-four-years old the male hormones set in —

WELL, GOOD TIMING.

Amanda Lepore: It’s harder to change because you have to correct the maleness that went into your body, you know? And then, characteristics like Adam’s apples and things like that — over the years it just settles in more.

I’M INTERESTED IN HOW YOU FEEL DIFFERENT ON HORMONES.

Amanda Lepore: I remember that after I took them, I was more calm. I was always sort of passive but it definitely made me feel more calm.

SO, YOU TOOK THEM FOR TWO YEARS. WHAT ELSE DID YOU DO FOR THOSE TWO YEARS TO PREPARE YOURSELF TO TRANSITION?

Amanda Lepore: I didn’t really do anything. I was seeing a psychologist. They would like talk to you. They wanted to make sure that I was adjusted and had support. By that time I had a boyfriend and his family was supportive of me. That seemed to please the doctor a lot.

WHERE DID YOUR BOYFRIEND LIVE?

Amanda Lepore: He lived in New Jersey. That’s where I’m from. I actually didn’t come to New York until after my marriage was finished — after the sex change and everything. I didn’t really have an interest to come to New York.

SO WHILE YOU WERE GOING THROUGH THAT, YOU MUST HAVE BEEN GETTING SHIT FROM PEOPLE. I’M SURE THAT OVER THE YEARS YOU’VE BUILT UP YOUR DEFENSES AND YOU KNOW JUST WHAT TO SAY TO EVERY TACKY REMARK —

Amanda Lepore: Not really. I would walk away from anything — and nothing really bothered me. I think I was so harassed as a kid that afterwards I didn’t get bothered as much, instead I just got bothered for being a girl. I noticed really quickly that it was easier for me socially to be a girl.

INTERESTING.

Amanda Lepore: And it was very difficult as a boy.

HOW DID THE OTHER GIRLS TREAT YOU ONCE YOU WERE A GIRL?

Amanda Lepore: I guess it was more a competitive kind of thing. They would be like friendly, too, and compliment you.

GIRLS ARE PROBABLY AN EASIER GROUP TO INTERACT WITH THAN BOYS WHEN ONE’S AN OUTSIDER — IS THAT TRUE?

Amanda Lepore: I don’t know. I really didn’t have a lot of — beside love interests — a lot of boy friends. It was more with girls.

SO YOU HAD THE GENITAL REASSIGNMENT AT LIKE SEVENTEEN OR EIGHTEEN?

Amanda Lepore: Uh-huh.

HOW DID YOU COME TO SELECT THE DOCTOR YOU USED?

Amanda Lepore: Well, I went to the doctor for hormones and things, and I think my father-in-law found out about the surgery.

WHERE DID THE SURGERY TAKE PLACE?

Amanda Lepore: In Yonkers. He was a New York doctor but he was practicing there.

HOW LONG WERE YOU IN THE HOSPITAL?

Amanda Lepore: I think like about a week. Because you have a catheter, whatever, like where your urine — you pee into a bag. So, you had to be monitored.

AS THE WORK HEALED UP, WERE YOU ANXIOUS ABOUT WHAT THE OUTCOME MIGHT BE?

Amanda Lepore: I was more relieved — and I really didn’t know what a vagina looked like. So, I trusted him and I was just so happy to have one that I didn’t really think of it coming out good or bad. I just wanted it so bad. It was more like a mind-over-matter kind of a thing. It was a big relief to me.

I SEE.

Amanda Lepore: It was sort of a work in progress that I didn’t really understand so much. I would just listen to what the aftercare was. I wanted it to come out good, so I worked with it.

WAS IT ONE SINGLE SURGERY OR A SUCCESSION OF OPERATIONS?

Amanda Lepore: It was a single surgery. There was packing in the vagina, to heal the vagina. So, I would be on painkillers and stuff — but it wasn’t so painful because there was only gauze in there at first. After it healed in a week or so — it heals very quickly. My healing was very good. It was coming out good. Then they put like a dilator, like a dildo-thing in it, and you’d have to wear it all the time — and that hurt like a knife. It was very painful. Because at first I was saying, “Oh, this is not so bad.” But after they put that in, it felt different than the gauze, and it was still healing, so it was like really, really painful.

AND HOW LONG DID THAT LAST?

Amanda Lepore: Well, the pain would be literally every day. But it was really painful and you would have to leave it in, wearing like a girdle and pads. If you went to the bathroom or took a shower you would take it out but then you’d have to put it right back in. If you sat down, it would go in deeper and hurt more. It was painful.

I SEE. AS IT HEALED, DID IT BECOME MORE SENSITIVE? WHEN DID THE EROTIC ELEMENT KICK IN FOR YOU?

Amanda Lepore: Well, the dilator was always in, all the time. So it started getting more pleasurable — but it was still sort of weird. Part of my stomach didn’t have any feeling in it. I would wonder if the feeling was going to come back. It did come back, but it took a long time. And then eventually I had sex with my boyfriend and it would get more pleasurable. Like I would say, “Oh, this feels good!” But I think the nerves and stuff got more sensitive over the years. And the sensation in part of the stomach came back — those feelings — so it would get more natural and sensual.

I SEE.

Amanda Lepore: I have better sex now than I did back then.

IN THAT IT FEELS BETTER?

Amanda Lepore: Yeah, it feels better. It got better and I understand my body more. Like, it’s not one-hundred-percent natural, but I learned you have to work with it. In that sense it’s a lot better.

YOU MUST REMEMBER THAT FIRST TIME THAT YOU HAD SEX AS A GIRL WITH YOUR BOYFRIEND.

Amanda Lepore: Yeah.

THAT MUST HAVE BEEN QUITE A NIGHT.

Amanda Lepore: It felt great. I always fantasized about being a girl. To actually really do it — you know, having a guy on top of you — just the whole thing was incredible. It’s psychologically so fulfilling. And that’s what I remember the first time being like. It was like a dream come true.

THEN YOU WENT ON TO LIVE HAPPILY EVER AFTER.

Amanda Lepore: Yeah.

THE SURGERY WAS VERY SUCCESSFUL FOR YOU. BUT I GUESS THERE WERE STILL DETAILS THAT YOU WERE UNHAPPY WITH, BECAUSE YOU HAD MORE SURGICAL ADJUSTMENTS HERE AND THERE, DIDN’T YOU?

Amanda Lepore: Yeah, I felt like my breasts — I would want them to be bigger. I was pretty and looked good in certain kinds of clothes, but some clothes I didn’t really fill out. So, I got breast implants.

HOW LONG IS ONE IN THE HOSPITAL FOR A BREAST IMPLANT?

Amanda Lepore: I think I went home — I spent the day in the hospital and then was released to come home. Or maybe I spent the night, I don’t know. It was short. It was either that night or one day.

Photo: Scott Ewalt

WAS IT THE CASE THAT YOUR BREASTS FELT BETTER AND BETTER AS THEY HEALED UP?

Amanda Lepore: I wasn’t so happy with the breasts. I think that’s because I was skinny and they weren’t really big enough. It didn’t really have cleavage. The breasts are something that got better with time by doing it again.

HOW MUCH LATER DID YOU GET IT DONE AGAIN?

Amanda Lepore: Well, I waited — it was like over five years before I redid them, and then the second ones came out better but they weren’t exactly what I wanted because I wanted more cleavage.

WELL, YOU LOOK GOOD NOW —

Amanda Lepore: They look beautiful right now. These came out the best.

THAT’S THE SURGEON’S ART AGAIN. WHAT WERE SOME OTHER MODIFICATIONS THAT YOU GOT?

Amanda Lepore: I had my behind made bigger.

WHAT DOES THAT INVOLVE?

Amanda Lepore: It’s more like body shaping. I think it’s sort of a proportion thing. Like with bigger breasts — the behind is more in proportion. It just looks different with different things.

WELL, IT LOOKS PRETTY GOOD, WHATEVER THEY DID TO IT.

Amanda Lepore: Now it’s perfect.

SO THEN YOU HAD SOME OTHER STUFF DONE —

Amanda Lepore: Well, I wanted to get my eyebrows raised and then he said that he wanted to pull my hairline down a little bit, that it would look better. It did. I hadn’t thought about doing it — he suggested it. He did it, and it did look more feminine.

DID YOU ONCE SAY THAT YOU WANTED TO LOOK LIKE A CROSS BETWEEN JESSICA RABBIT AND —

Amanda Lepore: Marilyn Monroe. I think I ended up looking more like Jessica Rabbit than Marilyn Monroe but yeah, something like that.

YOU LOOK GREAT.

Amanda Lepore: I’m very happy with everything.

AND YOU LOOK UNIQUELY YOU, TOO, SO YOU’VE GOT YOURSELF A SIGNATURE LOOK THAT’S GONNA BECOME PART OF HISTORY. I GUESS THAT WOULD MAKE YOU A ROLE MODEL FOR OTHERS. IS THAT THE CASE?

Amanda Lepore: I think so. I think a lot of younger Transsexuals look up to me. You know, I was in the media so much with David LaChapelle and all that — I think it really helped.

HE TOOK A LOT OF PICTURES OF YOU.

Amanda Lepore: Yeah, the pictures were successful. You know, it certainly helped — like, a lot.

BUT YOU’VE GARNERED A LOT OF CELEBRITY JUST BY YOURSELF, AS YOURSELF —

Amanda Lepore: Yeah.

I SEE YOU ALL OVER TV AND THE INTERNET —

Amanda Lepore: Uh-huh.

YOU MUST BE PRETTY PROUD OF THAT.

Amanda Lepore: Yeah, it feels great to accomplish so much.

WITH FAME COMES THE ENTOURAGE AND THE HANGERS-ON AND THE CREW — HOW DO YOU HANDLE THE PEOPLE AROUND YOU?

Amanda Lepore: I work in nightclubs. It’s really important to be social and everything but in my everyday life, I have just a few close friends.

TELL US ABOUT WORKING IN NIGHTCLUBS — WHAT YOU DO, AND WHO YOU MEET —

Amanda Lepore: Well, like tonight, I introduced strippers. It’s more a low-key kind of event. Sunday, it’s more like a crazier party.

AND WHERE IS THIS AT? WHAT CLUB?

Amanda Lepore: Tonight it was G Lounge.

I SEE. AND HOW ABOUT SUNDAY? WHERE IS THAT?

Amanda Lepore: That’s at Vandam at Greenhouse.

HOW HAS THE NEW YORK CLUB SCENE CHANGED OVER THE LAST FEW YEARS?

Amanda Lepore: There was a period where it was more like bottle-service clubs. I think that was a big change — but it seems to have gone back to how it was, I think.

THE BOTTLE-SERVICE CLUBS WERE SORT OF LIKE A MORE EXPENSIVE TYPE OF A PLACE WITH SNOOTY BOUNCERS —

Amanda Lepore: Yeah, but it seemed to dominate a few years ago.

AND BURLESQUE WAS BIG THEN TOO.

Amanda Lepore: Yeah, that was really popular.

WERE YOU INVOLVED IN THAT?

Amanda Lepore: Not really. I mean, definitely my singing has a burlesque influence but I wasn’t really involved in the shows.

WELL, DO YOU DO THE NIGHTCLUBS IN L.A. WHEN YOU’RE OUT THERE? THEY’RE QUITE DIFFERENT, AREN’T THEY — THE NEW YORK AND L.A. CLUBS.?

Amanda Lepore: I think they’re a lot smaller and they close earlier. I noticed in L.A. that people go to friends’ houses as a group.

BECAUSE THE BARS CLOSE VERY EARLY, BY NEW YORK STANDARDS —

Amanda Lepore: Yeah.

DO YOU SMOKE HERB?

Amanda Lepore: I have in the past, but I’m not much of a drug person. I don’t really drink so much, or anything — I’m more like a health nut.

IS THERE A DRUG YOU DO LIKE?

Amanda Lepore: No. I like going to the gym and going to yoga and stuff — more health conscious —

DO YOU RUN?

Amanda Lepore: No. I think it’s bad for girls, especially if you have the boobs and everything. Because of the gravity.

YOU LOOK LIKE YOU WORK OUT A LOT.

Amanda Lepore: Yeah, I work out a lot.

BECAUSE YOU’VE GOT TO SQUEEZE INTO SOME PRETTY TIGHT CLOTHES —

Amanda Lepore: Yeah.

LIKE THE STUFF I SAW YOU WEARING IN THE “COTTON CANDY” VIDEO. WHO DOES YOUR CLOTHES?

Amanda Lepore: I have different people — like Garo Sparrow does some of them. It’s mostly costumes. And Jimmy Helvin does a lot of them. Sometimes I’ll buy things and then take them to the dry cleaners and tell them what to do — “Take them in,” and stuff — but usually I get it done custom.

I IMAGINE THAT THERE WOULD BE DESIGNERS WHO WOULD BE ANXIOUS TO HAVE YOU WEAR THEIR STUFF AND BE SEEN IN IT.

Amanda Lepore: Yeah. A lot of people give me things, too.

WHAT DO YOU DO FOR SHOES? WHERE DO YOU GET YOUR HEELS?

Amanda Lepore: I like Christian Loubatin a lot. I always buy their shoes — like a lot. I think they’re made really well and they’re almost like a stripper shoe that I always wore when I first started working in the clubs. When I got money, I invested in stripper shoes. They were very high, like fetish shoes.

TELL US ABOUT THE ART OF LEARNING TO WALK IN HIGH HEELS.

Amanda Lepore: Well, that was always like easy for me. I mean, you just have to be more careful, and slower.

WERE YOU TRYING ON HEELS FROM AN EARLY AGE?

Amanda Lepore: Yeah, I tried on my mother’s when I was a kid.

DID YOU TRY ON OTHER CLOTHES OF YOUR MOTHER’S?

Amanda Lepore: Yeah. I was more focused with the shoes and the lipstick, though.

IT MUST HAVE BEEN FUN PUTTING MAKEUP ON.

Amanda Lepore: Yeah, I love it. I still like getting made up.

WHAT MAKEUP DO YOU USE?

Amanda Lepore: Well, my favorite lipstick is YSL, Red Venus. And I like lip gloss — Christian Dior lip gloss.

WHAT’S YOUR FAVORITE COLOR?

Amanda Lepore: I like red or nude. But I get sick of nude quicker.

NOW, HOW ABOUT YOUR HAIR? WHO’S DOING YOUR HAIR THESE DAYS?

Amanda Lepore: I have different people do pieces for me — but I always try to mix my own hair in with it. I mostly do my hair myself, besides getting it colored.

WHEN YOU WERE A YOUNG BOY, DID YOU HAVE LONG HAIR?

Amanda Lepore: Yeah.

WHEN YOU TRANSITIONED YOU LEFT YOUR HAIR LONG —

Amanda Lepore: Yeah, and I dyed it blonde to look more feminine.

WHEN DID YOU FIRST GO WITH A HAIRDO?

Amanda Lepore: Well, I would always kinda try to fix my hair like a girl’s in my free time. I would try to fix it as much as I could to look feminine.

DID TAKING THE HORMONES CHANGE THE NATURE OF YOUR HAIR?

Amanda Lepore: It changed it by making it more silky. I think I remember it being thicker as a boy. Coarser.

I SEE. WHAT MUSIC PROJECT ARE YOU WORKING ON AT THE MOMENT?

Amanda Lepore: Well, I did a new video with Marilyn and another one, Get Into It with Cazwell, and I have a full-length album coming out in the spring.

WHAT’S IT GOING TO BE TITLED?

Amanda Lepore: I, Amanda Lepore.

WHAT LABEL ARE YOU ON?

Amanda Lepore: Peace Biscuit.

DO YOU DO ANY OF THE TECHNICAL STUFF?

Amanda Lepore: No. I’m not that good with technical things; I’m more artistic. I do like to make things — I make a lot of my costumes and stuff. I like rhinestoning things, and making jewelry, and sometimes I’ll do the embellishment on the dresses and things like that.

I LOVE RHINESTONES. WHAT ELSE DO YOU LIKE TO PUT ON A COSTUME?

Amanda Lepore: I like Swarovski crystals a lot, especially on stage. They look amazing.

TELL US ABOUT THOSE —

Amanda Lepore: It’s just like crystals that you buy. They’re high-quality and have an amazing shine.

SO YOU PLACE THEM ON STAGE —

Amanda Lepore: Yeah.

WHAT OTHER ACCESSORIES DO YOU LIKE?

Amanda Lepore: I like jewelry a lot. I like earrings. Rings and things. And I like pasties and garter belts and things like that.

TIMELESS —

Amanda Lepore: Yeah, yeah. Definitely.

THERE WAS A TIME WHEN A GAL COULDN’T TAKE HER CLOTHES OFF IN PUBLIC.

Amanda Lepore: Right.

YOU MUST BE QUITE A CATCH, SO THERE MUST BE A LOT OF PEOPLE COMING ON TO YOU ALL THE TIME —

Amanda Lepore: Yeah.

THAT’S PROBABLY BEEN THE CASE FOREVER.

Amanda Lepore: Uh-huh.

NOW, HOW DO MANAGE THAT? HOW DO YOU HANDLE THE TRAFFIC IN COMERS-ON?

Amanda Lepore: Well, sometimes if you have a connection with someone, it’s right. Sometimes it’s not. Sometimes you stay with people and sometimes you don’t. They might do something that you don’t like.

HAVE YOU EVER FELT THAT SOMEONE WAS MORE INTERESTED IN YOU FROM A CLINICAL VIEWPOINT THAN FROM A ROMANTIC ONE?

Amanda Lepore: Well, there’s definitely guys that have a fetish for it, and you just kind of figure that out as time goes by.

SOME GUYS HAVE A FETISH FOR TRANSSEXUAL GALS?

Amanda Lepore: Yeah. Like, some guys have fetishes for bondage or shoes or whatever. Some do have a fetish for sex changes.

HOW DO YOU FEEL ABOUT THAT?

Amanda Lepore: I mean, it’s fine if you get along with someone — but it could interfere, you know? They’re not really liking you as an individual — it’s just a fetish.

RIGHT. WHAT DO YOU LOOK FOR IN A BOYFRIEND?

Amanda Lepore: I just like being happy. You know, someone that makes me happy — if it’s not something that I like, then they won’t be my boyfriend for long.

YOU WERE MARRIED, RIGHT?

Amanda Lepore: Yeah. Just once.

FOR HOW LONG?

Amanda Lepore: I think like five years.

AND HOW WAS MARRIED LIFE?

Amanda Lepore: It was good.

WHERE’D YOU LIVE?

Amanda Lepore: In New Jersey.

DID WORD REACH YOUR NEIGHBORS OF YOUR IDENTITY? WHEN YOU WERE MARRIED, HOW DID OTHER COUPLES —

Amanda Lepore: There was a problem because he didn’t want people to find out. So, it kind of interfered — like, he didn’t want me to work, and that’s why the marriage didn’t work out.

I SEE. HE WANTED YOU TO BE AN ANONYMOUS HOUSEWIFE.

Amanda Lepore: And I had a lot of energy and wanted to at least work at a cosmetic counter or something. He didn’t want me to, and you know, it really had to do with that he didn’t want to make people talk about us.

WAS HE EMBARRASSED ABOUT IT?

Amanda Lepore: Well, I think when he met me, he didn’t know — and when he found out, of course he saw me as a woman, and he was attracted to women, but I think it played on his mind. And I think he thought he could handle it — but he probably couldn’t forget.

HOW DID HE FIND OUT AND WHAT WAS HIS REACTION?

Amanda Lepore: Well, when I first met him, I wouldn’t have sex with him or anything — and then it got to the point where he wanted to kiss my vagina and not penetrate me. So, I had to tell him that I didn’t have one at the time —

OH, THIS IS BEFORE THE OPERATION.

Amanda Lepore: Yeah, I met him right before. His father actually paid for the surgery.

SO, YOU HAD TO TELL HIM THAT YOU DIDN’T HAVE A VAGINA YET —

Amanda Lepore: Yeah — and he didn’t accept it because he was thinking that I did the whole time.

HE MUST HAVE BEEN SURPRISED.

Amanda Lepore: Yeah.

BUT HE MUST HAVE REALLY LIKED YOU FOR YOU — BECAUSE HE HUNG IN THERE.

Amanda Lepore: Yeah — I mean, we definitely developed with liking each other.

WAS HE ANGRY AT FIRST?

Amanda Lepore: Yeah, he was angry.

WAS HE THREATENING TO YOU?

Amanda Lepore: No.

BUT HE CAME AROUND.

Amanda Lepore: Yeah.

AND WHEN YOU TOLD HIM THAT YOU WERE GOING TO HAVE GENITAL REASSIGNMENT SURGERY — THAT MUST HAVE INTRIGUED HIM.

Amanda Lepore: Yeah, he was very supportive of it. We thought the same.

WERE YOU THE SAME AGE?

Amanda Lepore: He was a little older.

I SEE. HAVE YOU BEEN IN SITUATIONS, AFTER THE OPERATION, WHERE GUYS HAVE HAD A HOSTILE REACTION TO YOU?

Amanda Lepore: For the most part, guys are really accepting. Once, I thought that someone knew — and they didn’t know — and it was way after I modeled for David — it was more known — and I thought this guy knew, and he didn’t, and he was a little angry about it.

OH?

Amanda Lepore: That I didn’t tell him.

WOULD HE HAVE FOUND OUT ANYWAY? I MEAN, WHAT IF YOU DIDN’T TELL HIM?

Amanda Lepore: Some guys know and some don’t. I think it was more easy to fool people before I was well-known.

NOW YOU CAN NEVER ESCAPE YOUR FAME.

Amanda Lepore: Yeah. It’s more difficult to find a guy who doesn’t know.

DOES THAT CHANGE THE EQUATION FOR YOU?

Amanda Lepore: It makes it easier for me, I think.

BUT WASN’T IT A THRILL WHEN SOMEBODY DIDN’T KNOW?

Amanda Lepore: Like when I first left my husband, it was exciting that a guy wouldn’t know. But now, I prefer someone that knows and accepts me. It’s more important to me than just like the thrill of fooling someone.

THE STEREOTYPE IS A GUY FREAKING OUT WHEN HE FINDS OUT ABOUT IT —

Amanda Lepore: You know, my body is so feminine right now that it’s easy for a guy to do it, I think.

AS FOR THE ONES WHO DON’T —

Amanda Lepore: I think they’re someone that doesn’t get the whole thing. You know, the guy thinks he’s gonna get pussy and doesn’t, and then he freaks out.

GUYS ARE CERTAINLY VOLATILE CREATURES.

Amanda Lepore: Yeah.

MOST PEOPLE KNOW WHAT’S UP WITH YOU, BUT FOR A KID OUT THERE IN THE HINTERLANDS WHO DOES THIS, IT’S A PRETTY DANGEROUS LIFE, ISN’T IT?

Amanda Lepore: Yeah. I mean, it really does have danger to it.

IT SEEMS LIKE A LOT OF TRANSGENDER PEOPLE WIND UP HUSTLING. IS THAT BECAUSE IT’S AN EXPENSIVE LIFESTYLE TO KEEP UP?

Amanda Lepore: I think it started out with prejudice, too — they didn’t really have a choice. Then they probably found that they make so much money — and then it’s really difficult to get a regular job. And then it just snowballs. You know, where it’s almost like a tradition.

THOSE FOLKS GET EXPOSED TO A LOT OF BAD MEDICAL STUFF, A LOT OF DISEASES —

Amanda Lepore: Yeah, but I think it stems from not being accepted, you know?

SURE. BUT THAT’S CHANGING, ISN’T IT?

Amanda Lepore: I think it’s changing a lot. Like, you find a lot of Transsexuals now have regular jobs and don’t have any interest in going that route. Where before it would be really hard for them to get a regular job or whatever — but now they have choices. There’s a lot more acceptance and good things going on.

THERE MUST BE AN ENDLESS STREAM OF CHARITIES AND CAUSES THAT COME TO YOU FOR YOUR HELP — I MEAN, THERE MUST BE NO END TO THE CHARITIES YOU’RE ASKED TO SHOW UP FOR, RIGHT?

Amanda Lepore: Yes. Well, I always like to support the underdog. I grew up as an outcast, so whatever I can do —

WHO IS IT THAT DOESN’T LIKE YOU AND IS AGAINST WHAT YOU’RE DOING?

Amanda Lepore: I don’t really know. I put myself in a really comfortable situation. I don’t have problems. I live in New York City and work in nightclubs and model and do music. It’s all things where it would be very accepted. I don’t know what it would be like to work every day where maybe it wouldn’t be as accepted. Sometimes I go away to perform and I’ll go to places like Ohio and be really surprised at how open-minded people are.

WHERE DO YOU FEEL THE MOST COMFORTABLE?

Amanda Lepore: I’m pretty comfortable wherever I go, you know? I adapt really well.

OKAY. WELL, THAT GIVES ME PRETTY MUCH WHAT I NEED HERE.

Amanda Lepore: Great.

IS THERE ANYTHING YOU’D LIKE TO SAY? ANYTHING I MISSED?

Amanda Lepore: No, I think that you did good.

WELL, THANK YOU.

Amanda Lepore: Oh, you’re welcome. I’m glad that we got it done. ~